Colt
By the way are you still in School and are you in Public School or Private School?

Congratulations Sir, You hit the X ring with that one.

Colt needs some real life experiences before he spouts off like an Expert.

Socialism is wrong... and that is what you are supporting.

... and even I know that if you are having financial troubles, you don't decide to have two children. I'm not stupid.

And you don't take governemnt aid for food, so that you can buy ammo with your own money.

And you don't own 5 animals, when you cannot afford to feed your family.

You have lost the arguement with common sense and freedom... so you are going to toss your age around, in an attempt to discredit my opinion. And, at the same time, discredit my hard work.
That is fine with me... I have nothing to gain by writing this. I am just sharing my view. You are free to take it or leave it, as is anyone else. It doesn't matter to me either way.

Let's look at this guy's situation.... he is 50, yet where is the retirement fund? Where is the "rainy day" fund? Why does he have 5 animals to feed, when he cannot feed himself? Why is he deciding to have another child, when he cannot afford to feed the one he already has?
It isn't society's fault that he makes poor choices.
We all make mistakes... but that is a lot of mistakes... and big ones too.

ok lets look at my situation and make sure you read every word because you are seriously confused son... 1.where is the retirement fund? still with the f-ing govt i cant touch it until im 62 yrs old. what rainy day fund? are you talking about IRA or 401K or are you thinking that i have enough money in hand to stuff in a savings account?
"Why does he have 5 animals to feed" because 2 are mine and 3 are my mother in laws whom we live with because she doesnt make enough on disabilty to live alone and my wife and i dont working..
"Why is he deciding to have another child" where the hell did you get this idea from? nowhere did i post about another child i said i had 1 child..
"It isn't society's fault that he makes poor choices." and what poor choices in your educated highly informed mind did i make? and while im on a roll im betting that you will turn down social security when you get old enough right? and medicare/medicade as well? as far as im concerned this topic is done and you young texan need to think first and finger later..

I'm done with this topic...

I am also done dealing with quite a few members here. The virtually universal support of socialism here as astonishing. In addition, I have been totally disrespected as a human being... being valued as a number, rather than a person.

LOL. Your hard work? By your own admission you only "help out" on the weekends. LOL. I know how much help you can get out of a 16 yr old. LOL. Now days, a 16 yr old can only do jobs with one hand, the other one is too busy pressing buttons on the cell phone. LOL

Yes, in the trueist definition, government assistance is socialism. We can agree on that.

Young man, let me give you a little insight. The world is not black and white. There are shades of grey. You have come on here and put down people for doing their best to make life as good as they could for themselves and their families. You have made statements that they have made bad decisions in life. We all have made bad decisions in life. I have had to make decisions that I did not want to but the circumstances of life dictated that I make it anyway.

What life altering decisions have you made?

Till you have walked in someone elses shoes, you do not have the RIGHT to critize them in anyway. Now, why don't you go find you a thread to talk in that you can contribute to. For you can not contribute nothing to this one!

LOL. Truth hurts. Live and learn. You have a lot to learn in life yet.

Colt

The problem is, you don’t have any idea of what life in the Real World is really like. Only when you personally go though the He** that life on this earth is really like will your comments have any credibility among Men.

You are probably pretty hot stuff among younger children and I bet they look up to you, but you haven’t even started living the life of a man and you are so quick to condemn real Men and accuse them of being socialists just because they are willing to take some of the money back that they have had stolen from them by the Government.

And it is you who has shown disrespect toward others by your comments.

And if you are done dealing with some of the members here I don’t think they are going to lose any sleep over it. And if I am not on your list please add me to it. I think you are just like a lot of the children I have seem who get old enough and then start thinking they are just as much of a man as a Real Man.

You need to grow up and act like a man before you start thinking you are a Man and expect Men to treat you as a Man.

Grow up, become a Man and live as Man in the real world for a few years then maybe you will see things a little differently.

I don'y think anybody here is supporting socialism, they're just supporting this dude getting his money back from big brother. If I had the option to opt out of the social programs I definitely would, because I trust myself to manage that money much more responsibly than big brother can. But I wouldn't try to claim benefits from those programs that I opted out of. Why, because I didn't put anything into it. I don't want to pay big brother for the programs, & I don't want to get anything out of those programs. Whether you're on the giving or recieving end of things, you're being controlled by the government. Either because you're big brother's bitch & it can take & take & take from you & there's nothing you can do about it, or you're now you're dependent on big brother, which rips away any self-respecting man's dignity to even think about.

I'm sure the gentleman here has had to go through a lot lately. Times get tough for eveyone, not always in the same form. I know a guy who had his entire family die off in less than 2 years. Wiped out, all but him. In this light, financial hardship doesn't seem so bad.

While it sucks having to apply for the benefits of these programs (especially when you don't even agree with their existence in the first place), he did put money into the program, so he should get his fair share out of it. Its those people who pay NOTHING into the program & then expect (& get) benefits from it that are the low-lives. These are the illegal aliens & the never-had-a-job-&-don't-intend-to-neither folks.

I don't own a cell phone. Nor do I own an IPod. Nor do I own a CD player. Nor do I own a "Game Boy". Nor do I own a "PS3".

I help out, as in help put the house together. I do a job, my dad does a job. We have not worked the past two weekends on the house, due to the hurricane. Instead we have been boarding up 5 houses, and thens ubsequently unboarding them and getting trees off of the roof.
Before that, I spent a day scraping dog crap off of tile, and bleaching down the house, after a renter moved out. Before he moved in a month before, we repainted the house, and replumbed the attack. I spend 4 hours with a 15 minute lunch break in a 100+ degree attack hauling loing pieces of copper pipe back and forth. After soldering was completed. My dad regulated water pressure, while I climbed through every nook and cranny of the cramped attic checking the joints for leaks.

Maybe you want to hear about the 4 lawns I mow every weekend in the summer, and every other weekend in winter.

Or maybe the 2 truckloads of dirt I nearly single handedly unloaded, so we could make the yard level.

You can disagree with my opinions... it is a free country, in theory. But, please, don't make fun of the work I do. I am proud of that work.
And don't compare me to your typical teenager that cannot stop "txting" long enough to wipe their own @$$.

I have made bad decisions before... and I do my very best to not get anyone else involved in a bad decision on my part.

I am done with this... I have better things to do than sit here and be talked down to.

Edit for spelling***

I don't think I ever stated he didn't deserve getting money out that he put in.

My entire point is that we should try our best not to get into that system.

We all do make mistakes... no one is perfect. I used the readily available example for a few ways I saw that we can avoid being on the .gov handout.

And, if it is used for extended periods, it does become a burden to others. There is a point where we take out more than we put in... and then it doesn't work.

I was primarily using Tobor's situation as an example, since he so readily volunteered such details. It was a pretty detached analysis, not intended to be directed as an attack at Tobor. Look at my refence to him as "that guy", or "this guy" or whatever it was... I didn't even remember who I was talking about. I was analyzing a situation, not a person.

No one likes being talked down to, so why did you talk down to someone yourself?

You are the one who started this Mini Fire Fight, and now you are going to bail out. We all have free choice so you do as you want.

By the way you did not answer my question about you being in School.

Where I go to school is not my choice.

It is a public school... and that is the government aid we get. School. And we pay plenty for it. And mediocre it is.

Even so, It was not a choice I made... the choice was made, I had no say in it. Now, I go to school and use tax money, or I go to jail and use tax money. Not a big difference anymore, but I still prefer to remain out of jails.

Sorry Colt your MREs and bottled water are no different from Tobors financial aid, I dont care if it was once or a penny there is little difference. That is socialism yes and very few here like it, but that is the reality of the system. You really sound dumb saying we approve of the situation in this country and its socialist facist ways. If there was sound money and a free market maybe Tobor and many others would have a retirement fund. That is a whole different topic.

You trying to justify it by thinking you have paid much more taxes than Tobor is sick in the head. Just because you feel you have to pay taxes to keep your lifestyle and 3 houses does not mean the government is stealing from you that means you support it, those who take from the govt are not stealing from you either. I would much rather see a patriot or someone decent get money over a wasted project or buying apc's for swat teams. The system might be screwed up but seriously where else do you think that money is going to go?

You are a very typical young kid thinking you know everything. You are the one with little respect for others and very little logic. In actual reality you said you do not support yourself or even have a job, you are a cog in your socialist family business. I am not trying to disrespect you I am just calling it like I see it.

Good at least you get the point I wanted to make.

Now are you going to stay in school after you are old enough to leave, and what about College are you going to accept any help or are you going to work and pay for the entire thing by yourself, that is if you are planning on going to College.

I will assume by what you have posted that if you can not pay for your entire education you will simply forgo it and just do work that does not require an education.

There are many things in this country that the Government helps pay for through subsidies loans etc that even you benefit from whether you asked for it or not.

There are aspects of what is referred to as socialism that are a necessary part of living in a decent Country.

What I am referring to is taking care of people after they can no longer take care of themselves.

Do you think your Father after he has outlived his useful life and can no longer work and contribute to your family or this country that he should be just driven into the desert and left to die, as Indians are shown doing in some westerns, or maybe just put him out of his misery. I mean after a person becomes a burden why should they use up precious food etc, they should just die, RIGHT?

And this also applies to people who though no fault of their own are unemployed, should they be permitted to starve or freeze to death or should they be fed and be provided shelter by the Government.

Think of this if a Race Horse is injured or is too old and can no longer race he is killed unless he has value as a Stud, so should the same apply to people who are dunsel i.e. no longer have a use?

Colt is a good example of why I don’t like young people.

This is the main reason I don’t like children or very young people.

One of my friend owns a large Riding Stable and most of the Trail Leaders (Workers) who led the Trail Rides were young girls some even younger then 14. These Trail Leaders had authority over the adults who went on the Trail Rides. So these young girls who at home, school and everywhere else had to take orders from adults and had no authority of their own, now had for the first time in their short lives been given power and as it has been said many times Power Corrupts and Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely, and these girls loved their power.

They even thought they had power over older people who worked there, like one of my friends and I. They used to give us orders and got ticked off when they were told to stuff it, and went crying to the owner, but they forgot that the owner was my friend and my friends friend, and he also told them to stuff it.

The girls took out the trails and my friend and I took care of the horses, including saddling them and even riding them first thing in the morning to take the edge off them so they would be safe for the girls and Customers to ride.

And yet these girls tried to tell us who were older and more experienced what to do in the barns.

This is the way it is with people the age of Colt. He has to live by the rules that adults set and if he ever spoke to an adult in person the way he posted in this topic he would be taken to task for it and told by his Father, to respect his elders, if his father is anything like mine or I guess most of our Fathers.

Most young people are like this and Colt like most should come to his senses when he finally grows up. But until then he will be an occasional pain in the posterior like most people his age. It is just a part of life sometimes adults have to put up with.

... I didn't say Tobor shouldn't get it. He did pay in, he deserves to take some out.

All I was ever trying to get across is that there are steps that can, and should, be taken to avoid the situation. I used a few from Tobor's situation... we all makes mistakes, including Tobor. I just called attention to it so others can avoid it. It is hard not to run into a problem if you don't see it coming. You guys are reading too much into my comments... they are not that deep.

We payed in too, so we use the mediocre school system, and got a case of MREs once... and for the MREs I spent a total of 16 hours relaying comms for FEMA, state, and county emergency operations.

Socialist family business? It is really more of an investment we pay the taxes on by renting it... both of my parents have full time jobs in accounting.
What kind of family do you live in? Being a member of a family is different than a socialist governemnt anyway...

No, Sniper, I am not dropping out half way through a year of high school. That is a waste of time. And, no, I'm not using the feds to pay for college.

If/when Dad no longer works... he will have some savings. And, his family will support him. That is what families do. They help each other. The government doesn't need to be involved. Those who somehow lose their savings, or their family cannot support them, have charities available. Charities are more efficient than government...

Your last comment is just a bunch of whining... there isn't much to respond to there...


Read Ron Paul's book, "The Revolution"... it might cure your "need government" mindset when it comes to social issues. Through family and charity, those who cannot support themselves can still live in a society. The government doesn't need to be involved... but, since we the people pay for it, we might as well use it, but try to keep the use limited so that we don't DEPEND on it. That is all I am trying to say... you guys are putting too much thought into my words that I didn't intend to be there.

Colt et al,
While I am certainly no proponent of socialism, and I have personally never benefited from any .gov handouts, I can understand some of the rationale for accepting it, and that is a personal issue (personally, if I had accepted it, I would be ashamed and would not be bragging about it on the forums).

As for the Economic Stimulus checks of 2008:

EVERY Federal Tax Filer for 2007 received a check, so before you tell everyone that your parents paid too much in taxes, make sure to confirm that they actually filed taxes for 2007.

Imagrunt, I believe you are incorrect on this point. After doing some calculations on the IRS website using their economic stimulus calculator, I received this message:

"According to law, the economic stimulus payment amount that you would otherwise be entitled to receive is reduced by 5% of the amount that your Tax Year 2007 Adjusted Gross Income exceeds $150,000. You would have been eligible for an economic stimulus payment of $900, but your AGI exceeds $150,000 by enough to reduce that amount to zero."

The AGI I used was $200,000. At $150,000 AGI, $900 would have been received in a stimulus check.

No offense intended, Sir.

If Colt is correct about his parents not receiving a stimulus check, it is because of their high income level.

Many of the people I know didn't recieve a stimulus check.
The ones that did get them didn't get the amount expected.

Turns out we gave them too much money... we payed so much in, we weren't allowed it back out.

OK I do not understand this, are you saying its a bad idea that your "Parents" did not receive a "Stimulus Check"...I mean after all if your net is 200k do you honestly need Stimulating...


MK

Colt

No my last comment was not whining, it was just an example of how people your age have a tendency to think and behave.

You are not the only 16 year old who thinks his you know what don’t stink, I have seen too many of them.

You are very insulting, even your calling my last post whining shows your lack of respect for people.

You are among men and think you are one but you are not yet a man, so do some growing up and get some real life experience living as a man in a man’s world.

Why don’t you just come hear to learn and ask questions and stop posting as an expert on subjects you in reality know nothing about.

There was another member around your age who used to have an attitude of superiority and used to make condescending comments towards older members, and post as if he was an expert on war and combat, even though he was no more then a child and had no experience.

Personally I feel that this board needs a minimum age of at least 18 before anyone is permitted to post. Even though that will not eliminate the problem it will at least moderate it.

This will be my last post on this subject, since you are not mature enough to understand what I and everyone else is trying to explain to you.

Sniper I believe you have to be 17 to join a Militia do you not? So why would this site be any different? In the reality of it is some of you may or may not be discussing something in Hypothetical terms and someone who is unaware of this might do something to bring shame to the Constitutional Militiamen.

MK

OK.... so we should pay in more than most, then get less than most, as in $0?

How is that fair?

We also spend a lot more time working than most people... money does not just grow on trees.

Were there, or were there not, two 14 year-olds fighting alongside everyone else at Lexington and Concord?

You call yourself a Constitutional Militiaman, yet you cite an unconstitutional law to back up an opinion you happen to have.

Hypocrisy is rampant.

Well, now now people. Let's keep to attacking the Argument and not the Argu-er or Argu-ee.

I don't think that limiting this board is necessarily the right thing to do. I was on this board since I was just under 16 as well, and now I am 18, and I learned a lot and have taught a lot to people. Life experience is important, I will fully admit, but I must also admit that I have a very big problem in watching people take government handouts, that I cannot get, yet am forced to pay for. Now, as I am out of the military and finished my high-school, I am a full-time Factory worker and I do live with my parents and I pay for room and board, and I am saving in the mean-time to get higher education.

My entire life I have been surrounded by success, and I have watched this country I live in (which is TEN BAJILLION TIMES more socialist than any of yours) continue to tax and whip my parents and friends and loved ones who work the hardest, spend the most blood sweat and tears to live on, and all the while give OBSCENE amounts of MONEY ($$$) (Dollars, not food-stamps) to tens of thousands of very pathetic, useless, annoying squeaky wheels, who long-ago dishonored their families by deciding that they would rather become escapists and avoid their problems by taking a Federal check instead of contribute to the community, and then dishonor their families again by spending it not on food or housing repairs, but on their never-ending supplies of cheap liquor and pot. And THEN, they have the NERVE to go and yell at ME, who pays more than 60% in TAXES out of my own Godforsaken income every year, money that I will never see again, because I am JUST over that damned little bracket that signifies the "poverty-line," and they whine that their needs are not being met and that they have no "quality of life," so now they want me to pay for movies and vacations and their plasma-screen TVs??!!!?!?!!?!?!
?!!?!?
?!!?!?
?!!?!?
!?!?!?
*Takes a Deep Breath*

It does not take much life experience to see that is a steaming PILE o' Monkey.

I went around, place to place, looking for 4 months for a job, voluntarily paying my way in my parent's house with not but the money I saved away from the Army, and I waited in the Employment center as the Stupid little students that no-doubt knew somebody that knew somebody to get that job told me day after day that "Oh, it's HARD to get a job, oh, it's so difficult to get by without the government." F*ck that Sh*T. I went and I found myself a job. Yeah, Factory work is some dirty sh!t, and you start at the bottem. But Hey, Its MY job, and I am earning $MONEY$ for it. Nobody helped me when I needed it. Nobody but ME.

In the flood of '97, the army went and helped the people on the perimeter, but they didn't help US in the city all that much in sandbagging. We did it ourselves. Thankyou Goverment once again for giving us, the people that PAY YOUR SALARY, the shaft. Damn you all.

Anyhow, I sound right now like a very hateful person, but I'm not, really. I understand that everynow and then, life craps on you, and your means to get out aren't quite enough. I know people that have had their families break apart due to drugs and alcoholism, and unfortunately they were left with nothing. They didn't need a handout to get them hooked on the system, they needed a Hand UP. Government can do this, I suppose, but then again, so can private insurance, and last but not least, the charity of your fellow man. My parents find a way to donate sums of money to 217 charities every year, in addition to the charity that they are forced to give. I'm not blowing their horn, but that is in my opinion, kind-heartened commitment. That is the kind that we need to see more of, and we need to see less of the forced kind.

All religious and charitable beliefs aside, If I am FORCED to pay into something, I BETTER get EVERY SINGLE PENNY back, or they had better think twice about stealing from me. If I voluntarily pay into something, a EXPECT to get every single penny back. Call me greedy, but fair is FAIR, and that's what its all about isn't it? what's Fair?!?

Colt is young, and he reminds me a lot of people I know, and partly myself, especially when I was new to this board. But I can at least understand his argument, especially after the experiences that I have had so far.

There are adults on this board that bring FAR more shame to the Constitutional Militiamen than Colt does. No names, but I think that deep down, most would be in agreement.

OKay, now go ahead and take your shots.

A very inspirational story Yankee Canuck... very inspirational.

You have read Ron Paul's book haven't you?

I don't remember ever paying taxes for Stimulus alone?

And Yes the more one makes the more one pays, that's the way our system works, and besides most people I know who make that kind of money do not pay any taxes they hire a damn good CPS to find the holes.

Taxes suck we all face it every time we get paid...

I do not qualify for food stamps but if I did I certainly would Take them...and my VA check I will be getting soon, you bet your ass I am gonna cash that.

My point is that the so called Stimulus funds were given to help the economy not the individual taxpayer.

MK

Both of my parents are CPAs. One of the reasons they work so much is they have to spend half the time just doing all the taxes. We pay taxes just like anyone else, except we pay more. You need to watch your false accusations.

And, what did that "stimulus" do for our economy?
That money could have been invested, and thus could have created jobs... maybe Tobor wouldn't be in the situation he is in if we had more jobs available.

But, no, we had to let the government take it and give it away for people to buy movie tickets and new TVs.

The stimulus was, in reality, just politicians paying for votes. That is all it was.
If it is good for the economy, why not let everyone help the economy? We can spend 300 free dollars just like anyone else can, so it doesn't make sense to exclude us from the stimulating. Heck, I have a long list of things I would like to have, maybe they should give me 3,000 and I could really stimulate things.

Typical government philosophy... just throw money at the problem.

"You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich. You
cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging
thrift. You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling
the wage payer down. You cannot further the
brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred. You
cannot build character and courage by taking away
men's initiative and independence. You cannot help
men permanently by doing for them what they could and
should do for themselves.

---Abraham Lincoln

I don't quote him often, since I don't like him much, but he hit the nail on the head with this one.
Note: This is not a response to anyone in particulars comments... it is just a quote I came across I feel is relavent to this discussion.

While I agree with Colt that recieving food stamps or any other govt. "bennifit" when not nessesary is wrong. I am not saying the recipiant is not truly needy I am just agreeing with his premiss. While agreeing with his premiss, I do have a problem with being preached to by a child, who has no idea what it means to be hungry. Tell us Colt, what kind of car did daddy buy for you? What college are mommy and daddy paying to send you to? You have no idea what the real world is. But I don't think you ever will. When times get tough for you, you will probabily just call up daddy and get some money. When I was of age I didn't have the good luck you do and had to fend for myself. So until you grow up a little, and have fended for yourself for at least one month
without any help, SHUT THE FUCK UP KID.

My Daddy did not buy me a car, and he has no intention of doing so.

He wants me to work for things, like he did.

I won't tell you what college I want to go to... but I will tell you it is not anything exceptional like Harvard or something like that. Just a school with a respectable engineering program, that is of reasonable cost. I have relatives that live near it, so I can stay with them and save some money that way.

So, you don't have a problem with the ideas I am sharing, you just hate "children"... great, that makes a lot of sense.

I have a problem with a child telling us how rough it is in the real world. Once you get out here THEN you have an opinion worth listening too. This is all I will say on the matter.

I don't think I ever sad how rough it is in the real world.... I just pointed out a few things I saw that may have contributed to the situation, and some ways we can save money to avoid such a situation.

I recall ever saying the world was tough, or the world was easy. I just stated a few ways it could be made easier.

You are not forced to believe what I say. You know what? I won't even make you read it. You just look at the screen name, and if it says "Colt" just skip right on over it. No one is forcing you to read what I type here, or forcing you to think it is good idea... you can it or leave it. I don't benefit either way.